Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
From: ladislas@sobeco.com (l.adamku)
Subject: Re: In regards to the Truth...
Organization: Groupe Sobeco, Montreal, Canada
Distribution: usa
Date: Fri, 26 Jul 91 15:38:41 GMT
Message-ID: <1991Jul26.153841.17795@sobeco.com>
References: <8377@rex.cs.tulane.edu>

In <8377@rex.cs.tulane.edu> goff@pops.navo.navy.mil (Viki Goff) writes:

>Did you know that you *must* decide who Christ is? Was He a madman, a
>con-artist or perhaps...perhaps...He is God like He says and what 
>He said about life after death is true? 

Did he actually say he was God?  Please!!!  He said he was the son of
man!  His fans (as in fanatics) said he was the son of God, because
they wanted their Messiah to crush the roman oppression.  He himself
believed he was an ordinary man with a purpose in life.  He discovered
that after seeing how people suffered.  He was exceptionnal in the 
sense that he chose his destiny knowing what would befall him.
(References taken from "Les Grands Inities",  sorry I don't know the
english title or the author). (If this you doubt the credence of that
book - as should be done for all books written by a human - then consider
this as personnal belief).

>I go to prepare a place for you...In my Father's house there are many
>mansions...

If this comes from the bible, reread my last sentence.  Books written
by men or women, as it is with any other type of communication, is likely
to be distorted by the author's *and* the reader's subjectivity.

>This is not religion, it's faith. God given faith.
>For by grace are ye saved, through faith, that not of yourselves
>but it is a gift of God.

God does not give faith.  You either build it up in you or else you
don't have it.

>Folks, I know you will have trouble believing this, but I
>see God's miracles on a daily basis. Religion is nothing!

On that I second you.  Religion *is* the politics of enslaving
people and making them believe they're on their way to something
better even if it hurts like hell getting there.
As for daily miracles, that's one way to put it.

>You know why people shun Christ? Because they cling to 'things'
>they don't want to give up. A Christian is not suppose to be caught
>up in the material world but many are. They will suffer for it
>and think it's Gods fault. The world laughs at them...

I don't think that people shun Christ.  If you don't know what it is, you
can't make a choice as to believing in it or not.  I say 'it' because
I believe Christ is a way of living and becoming.  Jesus showed his 
apostles what Christ using the example.  He reached something (??) and
once there decided it would be a good thing to show his students how to
get there (again, personal beliefs!!).

>I tell you, if you have the guts to surrender to Christ and
>live holy for Him, you can not imagine the joy and wonder it
>will bring you. You can not imagine how much good you will
>do for others and how wonderful it feels to make a difference.

It's not a question of surrendering to him or anybody else.  The point is
not to surrender.  You make a choice and stick by it.  You choose that
which you're heart (or intuition) tells you is right.  Didn't Jesus say
that our 'temple' is within ourselves? ( I know, bible stuff may be mixed
up through all the translations it suffered...).

>I'm not ashamed of this. This is reality. This is supernatural.
>Forget religion, follow Christ, He said that He is the Way
>the Truth and the Light and no one comes unto the Father
>except by Him. 

I have my vision of Christ, Jesus and all the rest.  I'm not ashamed
either.  I'm not tormented anymore by the fact that my vision of
Christianity is quite different from popular belief (yes, I used to be
but I learned that feeling guilty was a product of religious brain-wash
you get when you're a kid), in fact I feel good about my beliefs because
they are the product of my reasoning and intuition.

>This post goes out with a prayer that you will believe that
>I have seen proof of the existance of Christ Our Lord and
>I have the guts to live the life so that the world will
>know my sincerity.

>I know you want to believe because God has placed eternity
>in the hearts of man!!

>--v.goff

> Brian Siano, you call yourself a reverend and a philosopher, who
>do you say Jesus Christ is? We are all versed in logic and
>we would like to hear your most convincing argument!

> Don Allen, you write:

>After the Zeta Reticuli Greys move in along with their buddies, the Reptoid
>lizard-men..I'm gone too :-)
> 
> And you call me brain-washed...I hope you are kidding. But seriously, Don.
>Convince me that Jesus is anybody other than who He says He is. You might
>want to explain your post as well.

What you've learned of Jesus and Christ and what you believe is all you're
own.  If it brings you joy and peace, and will to live this life, then 
you have what you need.

I have my beliefs and though I share little of them with others (I've
been said to come from another planet), since I don't consider myself as
an apostle or "bearer of the Truth", I feel complete (or almost, I'm not
through learning yet) and at peace with myself and life.
I sometimes wish I could share them completely with others, but I have 
realized that they are beyond wording.  Trying to make others believe in
what we do will often put confusion in their minds, or the meaning might
be altered in such a way that the message is lost.

Have a nice day!
-- 
Ladislas Adamku

ladislas@sobeco.com
uunet!sobeco!ladislas